• Derry
  • Noisy neighbour
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  • Registered: 31 January 2011
  • Posts: 171

Re: Neighbours From Hell

James wrote:
Derry wrote:
James wrote:

I dont want to stereyotype, but maybe it is a Turkish thing to speak loud?

My flat is above a convenience store run by Turkish people and they shout all day - maybe it's a difference in culture. Whereas when I stayed in Thailand for a month, they almost whisper!

Regardless, their behaviour is definitley not on and you are right to be annoyed by it

Hi James,

Your not steryotyping,as my husband and I have said the same.We live in a multicultural town,and other races do shout rather than talk,but as you say its not on.People have to be considerate when living next door to each other.They dont only shout,they scream,and make lots of noise in general.I can honestly say that they are not nice people.When my husband and I went around their house and asked politely if they could be a little more quiet,as we can hear everything and cannot hear our tv.The son who is around in his 20s,was very cocky..I said "All we want is some peace"He told me to "Go and F...k myself,and said that they could make as much noise as they liked.It was all I could do to hold my husband back james.We cannot even get to chat with the parents who live there,they hide inside..The whole family desend on us,and shout over each other at us,so right away we thought..Ok we tried to be polite next is the Noise and Nuisance Officers.They as i said previously on here,an advisory letter from the Council,they were quiet for around a week and a half,then started again.nasty people they are.

Wow they do sound a horrible, selfish, anti-social bunch - but then many people can be like that these days and the decent suffer. Stick to your guns, do not be intimidated and take those bunch of idiots through the official channels. You will get great advice on this website and emotional support too

Hi James,

Thank you james.Yes they are very anti-social.I have said on here with my previous posts,that i am dreading the summer.They have BBQs in the harsh winter,so can you imagine the summer.We love to sit out in my garden in the summer,but i have a feeling this year is going to be hell,with all their friends and relatives.I know that they are burning toxic wood,as that is what they use for their BBQ,wood and charcoal.Its furniture wood that they use,you can see it on their patio,along with all the other rubbish.
They dont care how much noise they make James.They moved in last August,they live with their front door open in the summer,and stand outside in the front garden smoking,talking etc,they even walk up and down past my house on the mobile phone,talking loudly,I dont mean to spite us,as they did this when they first moved in,this is how they live,so we will be getting the noise inside and out.We are hoping that if they keep gathering outside the front,neighbours will complain,but i fear that it will be us that will hear them the most. : (

Quote Post 31

  • Derry
  • Noisy neighbour
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  • Registered: 31 January 2011
  • Posts: 171

Re: Neighbours From Hell

Mac99 wrote:

Hi Derry,

Firstly, machine do go faulty from time to time and on this part one important question you can ask when they come. That is what is the make and model of the equipment they are leaving.

Secondly, the statement by the officer that they have been to court before and lost a case over a child clearly contradicts what he has said before that they cant take a child to court. I would ask a question as to whether this was a noise abatement notice or ASBO.

Thirdly If they have been to court over a child before then they can do so again.

Fourthly I would also ask if they witness a nuisance by way of recording then they can serve a notice on the property.

Fifthly If they had a case thrown out before then surely they will be better prepared for the next time. Remember any court case can be delayed for the appropriate reasons and I do not believe any sort of a lwayer could not have asked for this.

You are right to question such a statement.

Remember all that I have said. I think it may be useful to only ask the first question today.

We will cover lots of other points later. Just remember all that I have said but one simple word procedures. Dont say that to him though.

Regards
Mac

Thank you so much mac.I will ask the first question to the officer,what if he asks me "why do you want to know?,what do I say?lol

When the officer told me about the child case,the officer said. "This is why we dont really press for court 
because when we did with the previous case,it was thrown out"???.My husband works for the same Council as this Officer,and knows him,as they both used to work in Enforcememnt.Now both my husband and the officer work in different parts of the council.My husband is of the impression that the officer doesn't want to go to court.I must admit mac i got the same impression.There are only 4 noise officers in the dept,and my husband knows all 4 of them.I am wondering if they are being lax,because they know my husband rather than if he were a member of the public not working for the council.Mac I am surprised of the lack of training these people get,by what my husband was telling me.You would run rings round them.I asked my husband "do you believe him over the child case?"his reply was "It does all sound a little suspect,and dont believe that a lawyer or judge would not ask for proof"I cannot prove what I am saying,as its to early to really make any kind of complaint,and will have to see what happens after they take a look at the evidence from the recording machine.
My friend said that you would think because they know each other,that the officer would go all out to help,not that I am saying that is right,but you know what i mean,but in fact I think it goes the other way.."kind of like,oh we used to work together,we dont have to push the boat out on this one" : (

Quote Post 32

  • Joanna
  • Up all night!
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  • Registered: 7 December 2010
  • Posts: 1,918

Re: Neighbours From Hell

I had the same problem with the equipment, had to wait another 5 days for them to sort out the problem, by which point I only had it for 3 days before the notice was served and therefore not a lot of evidence recorded  sad 

I got the same impression yesterday about the council not wanting to take my complaint to court as my neighbours are still having their tv on too loud and banging around more than they used to. I think they are trying to spite me and make as much noise without having the music on. God knows what they are up to during the day though when I am at work. The lady at council told me yesterday they will send another letter to the neighbours. What??? If a legal notice has not worked, I doubt a letter will. I know my issues are a lot better than they were but I just want these neighbours to shut up and stop bothering me with coronation street theme tunes!!!! The battle goes on!

Hang in there Derry. x

Quote Post 33

  • Derry
  • Noisy neighbour
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  • Registered: 31 January 2011
  • Posts: 171

Re: Neighbours From Hell

Joanna wrote:

I had the same problem with the equipment, had to wait another 5 days for them to sort out the problem, by which point I only had it for 3 days before the notice was served and therefore not a lot of evidence recorded  sad 

I got the same impression yesterday about the council not wanting to take my complaint to court as my neighbours are still having their tv on too loud and banging around more than they used to. I think they are trying to spite me and make as much noise without having the music on. God knows what they are up to during the day though when I am at work. The lady at council told me yesterday they will send another letter to the neighbours. What??? If a legal notice has not worked, I doubt a letter will. I know my issues are a lot better than they were but I just want these neighbours to shut up and stop bothering me with coronation street theme tunes!!!! The battle goes on!

Hang in there Derry. x

Well they have told us that we can have the recording machine for two weeks.What got me Joanna is that they said that they would bring the machine around tonight at 7.30pm.If the machine was faulty why did they not say "We will have to get it fixed,and will get back to you"or am i just getting to suspicious? i mean if they dont know what is wrong with the machine,how can they tell us that it will be fine for tonight?.

As I said in my previous post,i feel as if the officers are being quite negative about what they can do for us,and seem quite as a matter of fact so to speak,because they know my husband : (
I understand completly how you are feeling joanna.Isn't it awful that we have to put up with such awful people,so inconsiderate.The whole thing consumes us,we think of nothing else as we feel as if we have no life,peace,calm.My husband cannot even come home from a hard days work,and have his dinner in peace.We have put relaxation music on,"Huh"we can still hear them.I dont know how many times I have picked up a book,and had to put it down again for lack of being able to concentrate.I have even left my dinner because of their noise.Now as i am typing they have their tv up loud.My husband and I have even gone out to the pub "Yes the pub"to get away,because if its a monday the pub is dead.We have even gone upstairs to the bedroom to watch tv,and we can still here them,even though they are downstairs.You have been suffereing a lot longer i feel joanna,its a wonder that you are not going out of your mind.

I hope that I am not posting to much on here,its just that this is the first time that I feel i can talk to others in the same situation as me,and you have all been so kind and understanding.I must admit i have shed some tears over my neighbours.I have lived here for 19 years,and loved my home,now I hate it here.My husband worries about my heart,as i have been doing so well for the 5 years since my heart attack,he doesn't want me to have this stress.I think god must have been on my side a couple of weeks ago joanna,because where my neighbour had been sitting over his BBQ with toxic wood burning,in the damp,rain,snow,etc..He has been left with an awful hacking cough :)serves him right the silly man. I want to thank you all again for listening and replying to my posts,you are all such angels hugs to all of youxxxx

Quote Post 34

  • Joanna
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  • Posts: 1,918

Re: Neighbours From Hell

You are not posting too much, it is good to be able to get everything out there and you can do that here as we all know what it is like!!! Once it is in hand, you will start to love your home again. And with the amount of noise you are dealing with, you should be able to get some decent recordings and this will be more evidence that there is an issue. The person dealing with your complaint wont be able to dispute it nor deal with your complaint in any way that isnt following set procedures. x

Quote Post 35

  • Derry
  • Noisy neighbour
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  • Registered: 31 January 2011
  • Posts: 171

Re: Neighbours From Hell

Mac99 wrote:

Hi Derry,

You have floored me. I really am speechless. I have sat here for around 15 minutes reading your post again and again and again.

The first thing about 'going to court is that the serving of a noise abatement notice' does not automatically end up in court. It is only if the recipient appeals and this has to be within 21 days which is insufficient to prepare defence.

The only noise abatement notices that I know of that have been cancelled were on the basis of being wrongly worded and not because there was no nuisance.

A good example of this is York vs Elvington. York council issued a notice to Elvington. Elvington went to court and won because the council put steps to abate the nuisance in the notice without specifying what those steps should have been. What the council should have done is word the notice abate the nuisance and missed steps. Such words have gone to court before and the courts have held they are valid and if a notice doesnt state steps then it is for the recipient to take appropriate steps. In the Elvington case the magistrate still held that a nuisance had been committed.

York council wrote out a fresh notice, took out steps and reissued. Elvington carried on as before and York council did them for breach.

What floored me was you didnt mention your husband was known to all of the EH Officers. Such a crucial point. Any defence would be your husband is known to the officer who issues the notice. You want this part to be as solid as possible and will have to ponder on this and sorry to say it would be my own thoughts on this.

In terms of asking for the make and model you are a nosey person arent you? make sure you get it though.

My reason for asking for it is as soon as they have been tonight, put a post on with this information and going of the apparent reluctance, I think it may be an idea to make a data protection request for a copy of the data recorded. Dont do this or say anything until the kit has been installed and the officers have left. You should also be aware that depending on the kit they leave, there may be a cost involved which I think may run to around £150 and this would be payable to the council (but only if it a DAT machine).

Why would you want a copy, because if they come back with the wrong answer you want a copy for independent analysis.

Regards
Mac


I am so sorry that I did not inform you of my husband working the for same council.It just goes to show what sort of state of mind I am in.I feel as if as I have gone along on this forum,and missed so many things out,but now am up to date.
I am going to ask my husband to join this forum,he can be more pacific than I can.He has read your advice and admires your knowledge.
I will certainly ask for the make of the recording machine tonight,and will say,I am nosy and have to know everything lol.It seems rather strange now,that the officer went straight to chat about court etc,instead of what he can do for us,before getting to that point.Do you think that he was trying to put us off?because i have had this feeling since he mentioned the child case.Oh talking about forgetting things mac,here i go again.There was one occasion,when we phoned Noise and Nuisance,and complained about their noise,it had been going on all day,and it was around 9pm when we phoned,, the officer told us to phone back at 11pm,and if the noise is still going on,they would come out,we explained that this had been going on since august.Needless to say,the noise stopped around 10.30pm.I am just telling you this,so that you can see,what we are dealling with,regarding the Noise and Nuisance Dept.

Quote Post 36

  • Derry
  • Noisy neighbour
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  • Registered: 31 January 2011
  • Posts: 171

Re: Neighbours From Hell

Mac99 wrote:
Derry wrote:

There was one occasion,when we phoned Noise and Nuisance,and complained about their noise,it had been going on all day,and it was around 9pm when we phoned,, the officer told us to phone back at 11pm,and if the noise is still going on,they would come out,we explained that this had been going on since august.Needless to say,the noise stopped around 10.30pm.I am just telling you this,so that you can see,what we are dealling with,regarding the Noise and Nuisance Dept.

In terms of knowing the officers it isnt just a case of knowing one or two, in this case your husband is known to all of them. This will matter because an officer is supposed to be impartial.

I have been thinking on this and I think I will put out a feeler to a few solicitors and see what they come up with.

Ah the hours ... remember your complaint is made under the Environmental Health Act 1990 and the fact that they are investigating it under this act means this is what will apply. Not the amended version, not the night time noise act and not ASB act. There are no hours in the EP Act.

One further thought for you ..... What hours does the night time noise service operate? and what days ?

Why do I ask .... If the council doesnt deal with noise issues until 11pm why would they start a noise service before then. The fact you were able to ring up and speak to someone at 9pm suggests that it is up and running. Think about this !!!!!

Dont mention any of this but if you dont knwo the days and hours of night time service do ask this.

Regards
Mac


Thank you Mac it would be interesting to see what the solicitor has to say.I am waiting to see what the outcome of the recording device brings,well not so much the recording machine,as i just know that it will pick next doors loud shouting and talking,but to see how the Officers handle the situation,after the readings.

The Noise Nuisance Dept is open all day,I think until 5.30pm then a new shift begins at 7.30pm until around 2.30am in the morning.My husband may correct this when he joins this site,but I know that the Noise Officers are there until early hours of the morning.You so have a point,"Yes why have the office open,if we cannot complain about noise,for them to come out and investigate?"Another thing that they were keen to say is that,noise without music makes it more difficult to enforce.It all does not sound good does it mac?

Quote Post 37

  • Registered: 16 November 2010
  • Posts: 3,787

Re: Neighbours From Hell

Derry,

Remember above all....your not alone in this misery...you have a family of people who understand.  I know how difficult it can be to work things out, even what used to be simple things....are now difficult (for me)

Regarding the sound equipment....take Jo's advice....make sure they park away from your house, it may come in like a briefcase....and have your TV or something on to mask the conversation if your worried THEY will hear the arrangements and instructions.

Don't ever think your posting too much....were' all like breaking dams when we first join....with relief of being understood and not being told  "try and forget about it".....when your feeling at break point.

xx

Quote Post 38

  • Registered: 20 December 2010
  • Posts: 277

Re: Neighbours From Hell

I'd like to echo that last point. There have been many times I've come close to kicking down my nuisance neighbours door, but thanks to some wonderful and calm advice on here, have so far managed to avoid delivering some raw justice.

Quote Post 39

  • Registered: 2 February 2011
  • Posts: 1

Re: Neighbours From Hell

Hello To All,
My name is Randall. I am the hubby of new member "Derry". I have joined the forum to participate as well as I have joined to ask for advice and help.
Right,with that said then let me comment to "Mac" to the effect that one of our local Noise Officers has just this same night installed a recording device,said to be a "Nor" Model "130" Series of Sound Level Meter.
Also,I need to mention that when Derry asked the Noise Officer if her son could use our Treadmill once or twice a week for 15 minutes each time then the Noise Officer said "Yes".But when Derry asked the Noise Officer what would happen if our neighbours from hell complained about the noise from the use of the Treadmill,then he said,"We'll investigate it as we are investigating this complaint of yours".
Neither Derry nor I want any complaint made about us to our Council.Does anybody here have any opinion or advice regarding the Noise Officer's response to Derry's question regarding the possibility of our neighbours complaining about the use of the Treadmill? Thank you.
By the way,due to my fluctuating work schedule then I'm not always able to be online as much as others here or elsewhere may be,so if my replies seem few and far between then know that it's only for that reason.

Quote Post 40

  • Derry
  • Noisy neighbour
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  • Registered: 31 January 2011
  • Posts: 171

Re: Neighbours From Hell

Mac99 wrote:

Welcome Randall,

Randall wrote:

Hello To All,

one of our local Noise Officers has just this same night installed a recording device,said to be a "Nor" Model "130" Series of Sound Level Meter.

It seems to be a decent bit of kit.

If you want you can ask for a copy of the data under DP. This is something they should able to do easily and a copy of the analysis at the same time for the reasons stated before.

Also,I need to mention that when Derry asked the Noise Officer if her son could use our Treadmill once or twice a week for 15 minutes each time then the Noise Officer said "Yes".But when Derry asked the Noise Officer what would happen if our neighbours from hell complained about the noise from the use of the Treadmill,then he said,"We'll investigate it as we are investigating this complaint of yours".
Neither Derry nor I want any complaint made about us to our Council.

We all have the right to complain and I guess if you insist getting peace and quiet, then they have the same right.

You could explore the use of acoustic pad under the tread mill. If you google noise tread mill have a look at the results

I gotta say I am curious as to the exact nature of your job at council and wouldnt mind a PM with this to see if I cant pick your brains a little.

Regards
Mac

Morning Mac,

My husband will PM you as soon as he gets the chance to go onto the laptop.How does the pm work Mac?,cannot see a button for it.

Yes I was wondering about the treadmill.I bought it a while back after my Heart Attack to get the exercise that I needed,as i feel a little nervous walking over the park alone,and where i live its a busy town so not very quiet or much to look at.I injured my knee over a year ago,and had to have surgery,so found it difficult to use the treadmill,so gave it to my son.When I bought the treadmill,I asked the previous neighbours if it annoyed them in anyway,they said no its fine.In fact the previous tenants,even said "Oh dont worry derry,you need to exercise with what has happened to you"Meaning everybody knows with somebody having a Heart Attack,exercise is highly recommended.These people when they find out that they have been recorded will be trying to do anything to get back at us.

The Officer said that we can have the machine for a week,I am a little dissapointed with that,as he did say two weeks,but he did say that if we needed more evidence,he will bring it back.
He also told us that 90% of the time when a machine is put in,nothing comes up,as neighbours usually go quiet..HmmMy husband was suspicious of this remark,because the Officer knows the tenants Estate Officer.We had dealings with our neighbours Estate Officer,because when we complained about our neighbours,we waited over two weeks for a phone call from him,and also,he did not reply to any of our emails,phone calls,or messages left.My husband complained,well needless to say it did not go down to well that my husband complained.The Estate Officer was quite abrupt when he finally got back to us the estate officer said that he had been very busy,and that he had other business to attend to,he then proceeded to tell us that he would look into our complaint,and that he would get back to us in a few days,Hmmm another two weeks went by,nothing,the man was giving us the run around, to cut along story short mac,as soon as The Estate Officer knew that my husband worked for the council,he was not so cocky,and it was reported to my husband the estate officer saying "Oh i did not know that he worked for the council oops type of thing.The point that i am trying to make mac is..If next door to me go quiet for a whole week,and not a sign of any noise,something is not right.The Estate Officer has to be informed of this machine going in,so that he is up to date,with what is going on with the council tenants.
The only time my neighbours have been quiet for over a week,is when they got the advisory letter from the council of their noise,and when they saw the Officers entering my property a  few weeks ago,other than those time,there has never hardly been two days of peace since they have lived here.
We are sure that the officer was not seen last night,as next doors car was not there.This all sounds Cloak and Dagger mac,but my husband will pmprevious neighbours if it annoyed them in anyway,they said no its fine.In fact the previous tenants,even said "Oh dont worry derry,you need to exercise with what has happened to you"Meaning everybody knows with somebody having a Heart Attack,exercise is highly recommended.These people when they find out that they have been recorded will be trying to do anything to get back at us.

The Officer said that we can have the machine for a week,I am a little dissapointed with that,as he did say two weeks,but he did say that if we needed more evidence,he will bring it back.
He also told us that 90% of the time when a machine is put in,nothing comes up,as neighbours usually go quiet..HmmMy husband was suspicious of this remark,because the Officer knows the tenants Estate Officer.We had dealings with our neighbours Estate Officer,because when we complained about our neighbours,we waited over two weeks for a phone call from him,and also,he did not reply to any of our emails,phone calls,or messages left.My husband complained,well needless to say it did not go down to well that my husband complained.The Estate Officer was quite abrupt when he finally got back to usestate officer said that he had been very busy,and that he had other business to attend to,he then proceeded to tell us that he would look into our complaint,and that he would get back to us in a few days,Hmmm another two weeks went by,nothing,the man was giving us the run around, to cut along story short mac,as soon as The Estate Officer knew that my husband worked for the council,he was not so cocky,and it was reported to my husband the estate officer saying "Oh i did not know that he worked for the council oops type of thing.The point that i am trying to make mac is..If next door to me go quiet for a whole week,and not a sign of any noise,something is not right.The Estate Officer has to be informed of this machine going in,so that he is up to date,with what is going on with the council tenants.
The only time my neighbours have been quiet for over a week,is when they got the advisory letter from the council of their noise,and when they saw the Officers entering my property a  few weeks ago,other than those time,there has never hardly been two days of peace since they have lived here.
We are sure that the officer was not seen last night,as next doors car was not there.This all sounds Cloak and Dagger mac,but my husband will pm you.

Quote Post 41

  • Derry
  • Noisy neighbour
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  • Registered: 31 January 2011
  • Posts: 171

Re: Neighbours From Hell

Oh what has happened to my above post?its posted twice arggg yikes

Quote Post 42

  • Joanna
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  • Registered: 7 December 2010
  • Posts: 1,918

Re: Neighbours From Hell

I had the equipment for a week and after 2 days my neighbours had a notice from the council which is a seeking possession notice. It basically means if they keep the noise up, it can go to court to evict them if needed. I managed to get 4 recordings in the days after the notice before the machine went out. These noisy neighbour types dont care!!! 2 of the recordings were in 1 day! I would have got more if I hadnt been out at work all day, something my neighbours have no concept of!

They wont be niformed of the specific times of the equipment being installed etc, just that they may be recorded at some point during the investigation! x

Quote Post 43

  • Joanna
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Re: Neighbours From Hell

And leave the room whilst it is recording for 3 mins so nothing else is picked up!

Quote Post 44

  • Derry
  • Noisy neighbour
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  • Registered: 31 January 2011
  • Posts: 171

Re: Neighbours From Hell

Mac99 wrote:
Derry wrote:

Morning Mac,

My husband will PM you as soon as he gets the chance to go onto the laptop.How does the pm work Mac?,cannot see a button for it.

If you click on mac99 on any post you will see private message


The Officer said that we can have the machine for a week,I am a little dissapointed with that,as he did say two weeks,but he did say that if we needed more evidence,he will bring it back.

Come across this before

He also told us that 90% of the time when a machine is put in,nothing comes up,as neighbours usually go quiet..HmmMy husband was suspicious of this remark,because the Officer knows the tenants Estate Officer.We had dealings with our neighbours Estate Officer,because when we complained about our neighbours,we waited over two weeks for a phone call from him,and also,he did not reply to any of our emails,phone calls,or messages left.My husband complained,well needless to say it did not go down to well that my husband complained.The Estate Officer was quite abrupt when he finally got back to us the estate officer said that he had been very busy,and that he had other business to attend to,he then proceeded to tell us that he would look into our complaint,and that he would get back to us in a few days,Hmmm another two weeks went by,nothing,the man was giving us the run around, to cut along story short mac,as soon as The Estate Officer knew that my husband worked for the council,he was not so cocky,and it was reported to my husband the estate officer saying "Oh i did not know that he worked for the council oops type of thing.The point that i am trying to make mac is..If next door to me go quiet for a whole week,and not a sign of any noise,something is not right.The Estate Officer has to be informed of this machine going in,so that he is up to date,with what is going on with the council tenants.
The only time my neighbours have been quiet for over a week,is when they got the advisory letter from the council of their noise,and when they saw the Officers entering my property a  few weeks ago,other than those time,there has never hardly been two days of peace since they have lived here.
We are sure that the officer was not seen last night,as next doors car was not there.This all sounds Cloak and Dagger mac,but my husband will pmprevious neighbours if it annoyed them in anyway,they said no its fine.

Lets wait and see how it goes with the recording.

I will say that installing the equipment once is not enough for an investigation, so it can always be asked for again.

Just make sure to hit that record button.

Regards
Mac


Ok Mac will do..I seem to remember you asking me to let you know every two days regarding times,etc about my recording will do that also smile..

Quote Post 45